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 by Craptor, Level 42
Last updated at April 27, 2009, 10:57 pm
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Links:
http://twitter.com/
http://fmylife.com/
http://textsfromlastnight.com/
http://youtube.com/ (durrrr)
Anyways what makes these sites so interesting to me is that they have been successful in creating user driven content that is not only popular but able to generate significant amounts of revenue for its owners, and in many cases users as well.
When it rains, it pours and for many of these sites it is pouring dollars instead of water. There was an article done in the NY times that highlighted one of you tubes partners making 6 figures and had quit his job since he was making more with youtube doing a weekly video blog than at his normal job ( Link: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/11/business/media/11youtube.html?_r=1 ). Unfortunately many websites don't offer ways to make money for the users, but that doesn't mean the owners aren't cashing in, as I'm sure the owners of fmylife.com are doing as their website has sky rocketed in popularity finding themselves in the top 300 of alexa rankings, as well as an increase in traffic of almost 12500% from 3 months ago.
The big question I must ask, is how much longevity will ad revenue have. In a struggling economy it is unbelievable to think people are still raking in the dough based on concepts of ad revenue coupled with the snowballing popularity of websites based on user generated content. According to this article by inc.com about the owner of hit dating site plentyoffish.com this way of making money is not going to lose momentum any time soon ( Link: http://www.inc.com/magazine/20090101/and-the-money-comes-rolling-in_Printer_Friendly.html )**. It is a wonderful read, and gives a lot of great insight into the world of making money with websites from ad revenue.
So I'm curious as to how the gameriot feels about websites that ride the popularity of user generated content. Do you have any awesome ideas for a new website? What are you guilty pleasure websites? Hell you could even post some of your favorite funny anecdotes from fmylife or textsfromlastnight?
Some of my personal favorites:
if you force a hooker to have sex with you and dont pay her would it be rape or theft? something to ponder.
Hehe I wanna Australian kiss.. Its like a French kiss but down under
(917): omg omg i just ****** paul. i need to stop doing this kind of thing.
(310): wait, who's paul?
(917): exactly.
**Markus Frind (plentyoffish owner) also has an awesome blog that is worth subscribing too over at http://plentyoffish.wordpress.com/ where he talks about many interesting business related topics.
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49 comments
Iliekboyz Apr 27, 2009 at 11:12 pm
+0 votes
Doesn't this all stem from the human desire to communicate and socialize?
It seems natural to suggest that a 'new' way of communicating will be relatively successful, especially in the case of wowriot, it's a community centered around a game, which we have all played and share an interest in and in turn want to communicate to each other about.
Also something else to think about; These sites all have the potential to make you a star in your own right which is undeniably appealing.
If You have something to say, you can say it with no real attachment to yourself, the anonymity idea is probably a driving force behind it all, while also giving you the potential to become wildly e-famous with no real cost or losses if your search for e-stardom falls short.
Your opinion for the most part is looked upon on an equal level to anyone else, be it bill gates behind an internet alias or some wild heartless hobo, what they have to say is judged by the same communal assessor, us. Isn't that what allows for the success of these sites, equality?
Not sure if any of this meshes with what you're getting at, just a couple quick thoughts :S
It seems natural to suggest that a 'new' way of communicating will be relatively successful, especially in the case of wowriot, it's a community centered around a game, which we have all played and share an interest in and in turn want to communicate to each other about.
Also something else to think about; These sites all have the potential to make you a star in your own right which is undeniably appealing.
If You have something to say, you can say it with no real attachment to yourself, the anonymity idea is probably a driving force behind it all, while also giving you the potential to become wildly e-famous with no real cost or losses if your search for e-stardom falls short.
Your opinion for the most part is looked upon on an equal level to anyone else, be it bill gates behind an internet alias or some wild heartless hobo, what they have to say is judged by the same communal assessor, us. Isn't that what allows for the success of these sites, equality?
Not sure if any of this meshes with what you're getting at, just a couple quick thoughts :S
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Craptor Apr 27, 2009 at 11:14 pm
+2 votes
absolutely, the other addicting thing is the instant gratification you get through comments, reputation, +likes etc.
Iliekboyz Apr 27, 2009 at 11:20 pm
+0 votes
I don't know if i really like that these few are capitalizing on something as basic as the human desire to communicate and be social.
The way in which we communicate is becoming completely distanced from the original form of true communication; face to face conversation. I find this truly worrying.
will it extend to the point where i will require no real personal social skills in the physical realm, would sending a text message or an email substitute human interaction eventually.
I fear that this may already be the case for some, could we be breeding a generation that is socially inept? Or a society that receives it's social thrills through +1's as you've said.
I certainly hope the days of drunken disorderly conduct and the pursuit of intoxicated young vixens are not over.
The way in which we communicate is becoming completely distanced from the original form of true communication; face to face conversation. I find this truly worrying.
will it extend to the point where i will require no real personal social skills in the physical realm, would sending a text message or an email substitute human interaction eventually.
I fear that this may already be the case for some, could we be breeding a generation that is socially inept? Or a society that receives it's social thrills through +1's as you've said.
I certainly hope the days of drunken disorderly conduct and the pursuit of intoxicated young vixens are not over.
Craptor Apr 27, 2009 at 11:29 pm
+2 votes
Haha dude I really hope not, I don't know if you read my article titled "a generation unaware" but it touches on some of the social disconnect the technology generation has experienced. Being able to be socially adept is very important, and an invaluable skill, unless the workplace becomes completely virtual it will always be an important skill.
Iliekboyz Apr 27, 2009 at 11:55 pm
+0 votes
Unfortunately i didn't catch that post dude, though it's likely that a lot of what I'm spouting is probably regurgitated from what you've previously mentioned, judging from the title :P
That's something i see as a real issue though, there is every reason to assume that we will all work at home, eat delivered meals, buy everything online etc. the need for human interaction as a means of survival is definitely dwindling wouldn't you think?
also i think you deserve some e gratification, so now i like you ; )
That's something i see as a real issue though, there is every reason to assume that we will all work at home, eat delivered meals, buy everything online etc. the need for human interaction as a means of survival is definitely dwindling wouldn't you think?
also i think you deserve some e gratification, so now i like you ; )
Craptor Apr 28, 2009 at 12:33 am
+1 votes
Ya I would hate for something to end up like that, everything in moderation. I personally enjoy social interaction, and it is in our biological makeup to seek out community as well human interaction in a physical realm.
Don't underestimate thousands of years of biological programming
Don't underestimate thousands of years of biological programming
Iliekboyz Apr 28, 2009 at 1:35 am
+1 votes
Not to sound gay, and my name isn't gunna help here :P but those couple sentences reaffirmed my belief in humanity. Such a valid point, the strength of our biological nature and good will is something i think i overlook far too often.
Craptor Apr 28, 2009 at 1:40 am
+1 votes
I studied way to much human psychology, and behavioral psychology for my own good :X
Iliekboyz Apr 28, 2009 at 1:46 am
+1 votes
Hahah that rules, i just applied for early entrance to uni couple of days ago, waiting on their response.
Hoping to start a law degree coupled with a major in psych
got a couple friends in their 2nd and 3rd years of psychology study and the **** looks ******* immensely compelling/somewhat frightening.
Hoping to start a law degree coupled with a major in psych
got a couple friends in their 2nd and 3rd years of psychology study and the **** looks ******* immensely compelling/somewhat frightening.
Iliekboyz Apr 28, 2009 at 1:51 am
+1 votes
Absolutely nothing wrong with that, i pushed myself into a solely science/calculus based course in my last year of school, knowing full well I'm much better suited to a career in arts based subjects.
But the idea of abstract mathematics seemed too appealing, unfortunately I now know there is absolutely no way I'm up to that level of **** :P hence my decision to head off to uni.
seriously though, i admire your pursuit of math, it's certainly not everyone's forte :P
But the idea of abstract mathematics seemed too appealing, unfortunately I now know there is absolutely no way I'm up to that level of **** :P hence my decision to head off to uni.
seriously though, i admire your pursuit of math, it's certainly not everyone's forte :P
Iliekboyz Apr 28, 2009 at 2:03 am
+1 votes
Tbh i entertain this fantasy that there is nothing cooler than being confined to a wheelchair, talking like a robot and becoming a merciless physicist...
It was with this realization of what i found bad-ass, that i had to strive to become this, evidently abstract math seemed to be the best place to start :P
It was with this realization of what i found bad-ass, that i had to strive to become this, evidently abstract math seemed to be the best place to start :P
Nedd Apr 28, 2009 at 3:11 am
+1 votes
Iliekboyz said
Not to sound gay, and my name isn't gunna help here :P but those couple sentences reaffirmed my belief in humanity. Such a valid point, the strength of our biological nature and good will is something i think i overlook far too often.
GlitzBG6 Apr 28, 2009 at 12:25 am
+1 votes
anyone want to make a logical guesstimate on gameriot's ad revenue?
Craptor Apr 28, 2009 at 12:29 am
+1 votes
Would be really hard, google adsense can't be extrapolated very well. There are some programs that can kind of estimate adsense revenue based on alexa stats but it is extremely rough.
Iliekboyz Apr 28, 2009 at 1:55 am
+1 votes
If it is a substantial figure, having extensive knowledge of what appeals to the GR audience, I'll be making SexyGamePornAnimeRantDramaRiot and cashing in.
Craptor Apr 28, 2009 at 2:06 am
+1 votes
Well the way adsense works is depending on the type of site you get certain ad keywords. These ad key words are worth different values. Typically the Click rate is 1.5% across most sites (where the impulse/1000 comes in), and depending on the key word average value you multiply that by every 1000 views to get your ad revenue. Key word values have a wide range, some might be free, some might be 8-10 dollars. I think the average is around 4.5? so for every 1000 views you would be getting 4.5 dollars, at least that is how I've come to understand it.
Read this if you want to learn more:
http://forum.abestweb.com/showthread.php?t=20859
Read this if you want to learn more:
http://forum.abestweb.com/showthread.php?t=20859
Iliekboyz Apr 28, 2009 at 2:10 am
+1 votes
I figured it was word driven, hence the ridiculous site title i imagined.
i'll definitely have a wee look
i'll definitely have a wee look
AeoltheGrammarChecker Apr 28, 2009 at 2:11 am
+2 votes
Youtube has been losing TONS of money for a while, with Google having to carry it on its shoulders while they find a way to actually make money. There are just way too many useless videos out there.
Iliekboyz Apr 28, 2009 at 2:30 am
+1 votes
just out of curiosity, not saying that i doubt you, where did you find this out man ?
?Craptor Apr 28, 2009 at 2:33 am
+1 votes
youtube has a hard time advertising in videos because of infringement on content, hence why they made the partners program. Read the NY times article it talks about it a little.
AeoltheGrammarChecker Apr 28, 2009 at 2:33 am
+1 votes
http://www.multichannel.com/article/191223-YouTube_May_Lose_470_Million_In_2009_Analysts.php
Just Google "Youtube losing money".
Just Google "Youtube losing money".
Iliekboyz Apr 28, 2009 at 2:37 am
+1 votes
Thanks a lot man, i was under the assumption that there would be plenty of money making potential through adverts from such a vastly popular site. Interesting stuff
AeoltheGrammarChecker Apr 28, 2009 at 3:31 am
+1 votes
Yeah they do make good money I guess, but there is just so much useless **** uploaded every millisecond which gives no return since it barely gets enough views, so in the end they have a big gap to cover.
Iliekboyz Apr 28, 2009 at 3:32 am
+1 votes
Are you looking at the storage side of it?
I never really considered it from that side of things, the videos have to go somewhere :P
I never really considered it from that side of things, the videos have to go somewhere :P
Craptor Apr 28, 2009 at 3:36 am
+1 votes
for youtube i imagine there is a lot of overheard from bandwidth costs, from text based sites I can't imagine the overhead being anywhere in the same realm.
Vir Apr 28, 2009 at 1:36 pm
+1 votes
Iliekboyz said
Thanks a lot man, i was under the assumption that there would be plenty of money making potential through adverts from such a vastly popular site. Interesting stuff
http://www.businessinsider.com/is-youtube-doomed-2009-4
Nedd Apr 28, 2009 at 3:14 am
+1 votes
I didn't feel like reading through all the comments so I dunno if it's already been said, but I feel like a ton of the stuff on FML and textsfromlastnight is complete bull**** and made up just for attention. And I'm not saying that because I don't believe crazy stuff could happen because I've experienced some of my own, but some of the stuff just is too far fetched to be real, not to mention the way it's presented by the people.
Craptor Apr 28, 2009 at 3:18 am
+1 votes
1) As a college student, I can attest to a lot of the **** being true.
2) Even if it isn't true, but it is still funny who cares? The point is for people to waste time and have a good laugh.
Going back to point 2, clearly people are eating this **** up, so good for them.
2) Even if it isn't true, but it is still funny who cares? The point is for people to waste time and have a good laugh.
Going back to point 2, clearly people are eating this **** up, so good for them.
Apolaustic Apr 28, 2009 at 8:59 am
+1 votes
Thanks for this. After reading that link I actually created a blogger and a google Adsense account. I'm also thinking about starting a website now. When it becomes successful I'll track you down and reimberse you somehow. Notice the use of 'when' instead of 'if'. Positive thinking is key!
oradol Apr 28, 2009 at 11:50 am
+1 votes
Youtube bandwidth is probably quite expensive, but is a manageable variable cost. Bandwidth goes up at the same time, and proportionally, to advertising revenue which makes it not too bad. Storage is what I imagine kills Youtube, because even an unwatched video takes up space.
The other sites are much more profitable I think.
The other sites are much more profitable I think.
briyan Apr 28, 2009 at 12:17 pm
+1 votes
oradol said
Youtube bandwidth is probably quite expensive, but is a manageable variable cost. Bandwidth goes up at the same time, and proportionally, to advertising revenue which makes it not too bad. Storage is what I imagine kills Youtube, because even an unwatched video takes up space.
The other sites are much more profitable I think.
The other sites are much more profitable I think.
oradol Apr 28, 2009 at 1:09 pm
+1 votes
Kills them in relation to other sites that is. Storage costs might be low, but they're a cost that Digg, FML, etc. do not have to face. If normal profits in the industry are 6%, storage costs of 2% are cutting pretty deep into Youtube's profits compared to a site that doesn't have to manage them.
Vir Apr 28, 2009 at 1:45 pm
+1 votes
briyan said
But storage is so uber-cheap, why do you think that would be killing YouTube?
This guy clams they've got $650,000 in ad revenue a day, while spending $1,000,000 a day on bandwidth
TeeKoo Apr 28, 2009 at 12:27 pm
+1 votes
Must be something more than just storage, i read somewhere that Digg and Reddit, sites which basically just are links from other sites are barely making any money.
oradol Apr 28, 2009 at 1:49 pm
+3 votes
The nature of Digg is to blame too. Advertising prices are based on CPM (cost per thousand), so the variation in price is a product of market selectivity. I suppose Digg is geared a little more towards the tech-savvy niche, but the site is very broad in its content. Everyone loads up that same front page and follows the links, making it difficult for them to focus in on their target market. If I buy an ad on the front page of where most of the traffic hits, I'm accepting that the message of my ad is going to be lost on most of the people who see it.
Imagine a bicycle company trying to choose what site to advertise on. I can advertise on Digg where 10% of the visitors are in my target market, or on a cycling website where 80% of the visitors are in my target market. This drives Digg's CPM down. Bandwidth costs, however, are virtually the same between the two sites for those thousand people.
Compare that to Facebook. I've given them a database with everything they need - not only all the demographic information they could every ask for, but a list of my interests. They also know the interests and habits of all my my friends. The moment I log into that Facebook site they're able to target me. If I'm set to single they know to advertise dating services, and if I like hockey they know to target me there. I don't know when the last time was that I clicked on an ad on any non-FB page, but frequently they have products pop up I'm actually interested in like t-shirts for my favourite shows. It's hard for Digg to compete with these sites.
Imagine a bicycle company trying to choose what site to advertise on. I can advertise on Digg where 10% of the visitors are in my target market, or on a cycling website where 80% of the visitors are in my target market. This drives Digg's CPM down. Bandwidth costs, however, are virtually the same between the two sites for those thousand people.
Compare that to Facebook. I've given them a database with everything they need - not only all the demographic information they could every ask for, but a list of my interests. They also know the interests and habits of all my my friends. The moment I log into that Facebook site they're able to target me. If I'm set to single they know to advertise dating services, and if I like hockey they know to target me there. I don't know when the last time was that I clicked on an ad on any non-FB page, but frequently they have products pop up I'm actually interested in like t-shirts for my favourite shows. It's hard for Digg to compete with these sites.
TeeKoo Apr 28, 2009 at 2:08 pm
+1 votes
My after work attention span is low, so in short "yeah, prolly" and +1
Vir Apr 28, 2009 at 2:39 pm
+1 votes
Everyone loads up that same front page and follows the links, making it
difficult for them to focus in on their target market. If I buy an ad
on the front page of where most of the traffic hits, I'm accepting that
the message of my ad is going to be lost on most of the people who see
it.
13-34 Male. I'd bet that is 80% of Digg's front page audience.
Imagine a bicycle company trying to choose what site to advertise on. I
can advertise on Digg where 10% of the visitors are in my target
market, or on a cycling website where 80% of the visitors are in my
target market.
Digg is probably tracking what categories the stories you click on are in. So they can provide some user interests (ie, Games).
difficult for them to focus in on their target market. If I buy an ad
on the front page of where most of the traffic hits, I'm accepting that
the message of my ad is going to be lost on most of the people who see
it.
13-34 Male. I'd bet that is 80% of Digg's front page audience.
Imagine a bicycle company trying to choose what site to advertise on. I
can advertise on Digg where 10% of the visitors are in my target
market, or on a cycling website where 80% of the visitors are in my
target market.
Digg is probably tracking what categories the stories you click on are in. So they can provide some user interests (ie, Games).
oradol Apr 28, 2009 at 4:10 pm
+1 votes
Vir said
Everyone loads up that same front page and follows the links, making it
difficult for them to focus in on their target market. If I buy an ad
on the front page of where most of the traffic hits, I'm accepting that
the message of my ad is going to be lost on most of the people who see
it.
13-34 Male. I'd bet that is 80% of Digg's front page audience.
Imagine a bicycle company trying to choose what site to advertise on. I
can advertise on Digg where 10% of the visitors are in my target
market, or on a cycling website where 80% of the visitors are in my
target market.
Digg is probably tracking what categories the stories you click on are in. So they can provide some user interests (ie, Games).
difficult for them to focus in on their target market. If I buy an ad
on the front page of where most of the traffic hits, I'm accepting that
the message of my ad is going to be lost on most of the people who see
it.
13-34 Male. I'd bet that is 80% of Digg's front page audience.
Imagine a bicycle company trying to choose what site to advertise on. I
can advertise on Digg where 10% of the visitors are in my target
market, or on a cycling website where 80% of the visitors are in my
target market.
Digg is probably tracking what categories the stories you click on are in. So they can provide some user interests (ie, Games).
I think if they want to make money, they need to design their site so that they can feed ads to people as they read the article. Digg should be profitable, they also seem to be a very bloated company employing something like 75 people when I can't see how they need more than 10-15.
TeeKoo Apr 28, 2009 at 12:22 pm
+1 votes
I had a good dilbert comic link for this blog, but lost it now
Vir Apr 28, 2009 at 1:33 pm
+1 votes
Neither YouTube nor Twitter are profitable. YouTube will always have problems being profitable via ads because of the amount of bandwidth they consume vs how many people will watch/click ads.
PlentyOfFish, FMyLife, Bash.org and GroupHug.us could all be profitable simply because their cost of operation is likely very low.
I really think Twitter, like Digg should have sold their websites long ago to some suckers that would buy them at insane prices. If you have a real economic downturn nobody will want to sink cash into questionable ventures that might not be profitable.
I think user generated websites are great because of the low overhead. Really you just need a programmer (or you can rent one) and an idea. Development and hosting costs are so minimal nowadays.
Also, it's hard to figure out how Gameriot is profitable when they're paying Slapnuts $125,000 a year.
PlentyOfFish, FMyLife, Bash.org and GroupHug.us could all be profitable simply because their cost of operation is likely very low.
I really think Twitter, like Digg should have sold their websites long ago to some suckers that would buy them at insane prices. If you have a real economic downturn nobody will want to sink cash into questionable ventures that might not be profitable.
I think user generated websites are great because of the low overhead. Really you just need a programmer (or you can rent one) and an idea. Development and hosting costs are so minimal nowadays.
Also, it's hard to figure out how Gameriot is profitable when they're paying Slapnuts $125,000 a year.
domper Apr 28, 2009 at 2:20 pm
+1 votes
Vir said
Neither YouTube nor Twitter are profitable. YouTube will always have problems being profitable via ads because of the amount of bandwidth they consume vs how many people will watch/click ads.
PlentyOfFish, FMyLife, Bash.org and GroupHug.us could all be profitable simply because their cost of operation is likely very low.
I really think Twitter, like Digg should have sold their websites long ago to some suckers that would buy them at insane prices. If you have a real economic downturn nobody will want to sink cash into questionable ventures that might not be profitable.
I think user generated websites are great because of the low overhead. Really you just need a programmer (or you can rent one) and an idea. Development and hosting costs are so minimal nowadays.
Also, it's hard to figure out how Gameriot is profitable when they're paying Slapnuts $125,000 a year.
PlentyOfFish, FMyLife, Bash.org and GroupHug.us could all be profitable simply because their cost of operation is likely very low.
I really think Twitter, like Digg should have sold their websites long ago to some suckers that would buy them at insane prices. If you have a real economic downturn nobody will want to sink cash into questionable ventures that might not be profitable.
I think user generated websites are great because of the low overhead. Really you just need a programmer (or you can rent one) and an idea. Development and hosting costs are so minimal nowadays.
Also, it's hard to figure out how Gameriot is profitable when they're paying Slapnuts $125,000 a year.
Edit: the 125 000$ one. I suck at HTML.
Slapnuts Apr 28, 2009 at 2:50 pm
+1 votes
Also, it's hard to figure out how Gameriot is profitable when they're paying Slapnuts $125,000 a year
Do I have a raise on the way I don't know about? Please send that request to Rage, thanks!
Do I have a raise on the way I don't know about? Please send that request to Rage, thanks!
Vir Apr 28, 2009 at 3:47 pm
+1 votes
Slapnuts said
Also, it's hard to figure out how Gameriot is profitable when they're paying Slapnuts $125,000 a year
Do I have a raise on the way I don't know about? Please send that request to Rage, thanks!
Do I have a raise on the way I don't know about? Please send that request to Rage, thanks!
Smokeee Apr 28, 2009 at 6:24 pm
+1 votes
Youtube has so many users and traffic, i'd imagine they get much more in terms of advertising costs. They also have some type of joint ventures with CNN and i'd imagine many other big companies. Its hard to believe they don't generate much profit.
Don't know about Twitter.
Don't know about Twitter.
Vir Apr 28, 2009 at 8:17 pm
+1 votes
Smokeee said
Youtube has so many users and traffic, i'd imagine they get much more in terms of advertising costs. They also have some type of joint ventures with CNN and i'd imagine many other big companies. Its hard to believe they don't generate much profit.
Don't know about Twitter.
Don't know about Twitter.
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