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by aimlessgun, Level 31
Last updated at April 21, 2008, 5:27 pm
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Why would such a thing be a good idea? Isn't that sort of abusive and unfair for such a mod to exist? Well, a lot of people regard the current gearing situation on the TR as abusive and unfair. The availability of PvE gear opens up a lot of options for certain classes that are bad targets in many comps, often allowing them to sacrifice resilience to become more powerful than they should (though of course that is up for debate).
The biggest offenders thus far are rogues. Flipping through the rogue armory pages in the top 40, the average resil is below 200, with rogues on certain gib teams such as Spriest/Rogue/Shaman at sub-50 resil. They can afford to do this because a rogue is generally a subpar target in basically any matrix: with Cheat Death, Evasion, Vanish and Cloak they have too many outs. Focusing a warrior makes him play defensively, pull out a shield and switch to D-stance: a focused rogue just keeps on trucking. There are other examples, such as druids in PvE gear who can Innervate themselves for vast quantities as opposed to PvP geared druids and thus easily win in the long game.
Without easy knowledge of what players are wearing (I can switch in 200 spell damage and switch out 200 resil on my warlock with zero change in appearance), this PvE gear situation quickly turns into a crapshoot: is that druid wearing PvE gear this time? Should we try to down him, or have we been juked, and our attempts destined to failure because he put on 370 resil for this one?
So back to the mod. I've actually tested my values for Corruption in standard gearset vs variable levels of resilience, and I can manually observe how much resil someone is wearing. But that's a pain in the ass. So if some talented programmer wants to do us all a service, get to it!
PS: Yes some classes won't be able to benefit from this because it's only convenient to get values from ranged DoT effects. Warlocks obviously have a variety of things, Druids have moonfire/IS, Priests have SW:P, hunters have that one DoT sting nobody ever uses. Between those 4 you'll probably have one on your team :p

29 comments
zyZ- Apr 21, 2008 at 5:32 pm
+1 votes
Wouldn't this basically never work against a RMP team or anything with resist buffs?
magdain Apr 21, 2008 at 5:58 pm
+1 votes
There's probably a combat log event/parameter for partial resists and you could exclude them.
aimlessgun Apr 21, 2008 at 5:37 pm
+1 votes
That is a good point, but I don't think it's a major obstacle. Partial resists are not gauranteed, and since I believe they work on a 25%-50%-75%-100% reduction interval, partial resist numbers would be outside the range of expected values and could be thrown out.
affix Apr 21, 2008 at 5:44 pm
+1 votes
This is definitely doable and really a great idea. I'd talk to a few mod makers and see if there's any interest. Proximo integration is the most obvious pairing, I'd leave a comment on his Wowinterface portal.
pudlol Apr 21, 2008 at 5:57 pm
+1 votes
From Mr. Mod himself wanting more mods!
Decision making ingame is haaaaard. WoW needs to be easier.
Decision making ingame is haaaaard. WoW needs to be easier.
aimlessgun Apr 21, 2008 at 6:02 pm
+1 votes
This isn't about making the game easier at all. It's about giving people information to deal with a situation on the TR that many see as abusive, unfun, and detrimental to good competition.
Good idea about wowinterface, left a suggestion for the proximo guy.
Good idea about wowinterface, left a suggestion for the proximo guy.
krakatoan Apr 21, 2008 at 6:55 pm
+1 votes
what exactly would knowing a player's exact resilience value change? if it's already known that various teams are running low resilience on rogues, then shouldn't people simply try killing rogues a bit more often, especially if they are facing a well known team that runs low resilience?
affix Apr 21, 2008 at 7:29 pm
+1 votes
A rogue in full T5 looks exactly the same as a rogue in full arena gear. They can switch back and forth, game to game, and you'll have no way of knowing unless you start attacking them. Being able to dot them once and know if they're in resilience gear or PvE gear would be nice.
razed Apr 22, 2008 at 3:46 pm
+1 votes
one has 100 energy the other doesnt
yeah some of us have thought beyond the box heh heh
yeah some of us have thought beyond the box heh heh
affix Apr 22, 2008 at 5:44 pm
+1 votes
That's true on the TTR, but on live rogues can use 4 piece S4 and 4 piece T6. Regardless, there's no reason NOT to integrate it on to Proximo :P
bife Apr 21, 2008 at 7:39 pm
+1 votes
what ever happened to 'hey this guy is taking little damage, he's probably wearing a lot of resilience, let's switch'
is it that hard to notice your dots are ticking for more/less than they usually do?
is it that hard to notice your dots are ticking for more/less than they usually do?
aimlessgun Apr 21, 2008 at 8:05 pm
+1 votes
I'm already tracking manually. I think a mod would just be convenient, and half the purpose would be to just discourage the use of excessive PvE gear in general.
bife Apr 22, 2008 at 9:56 am
+1 votes
this reminds me how in many TF2 servers as a spy you can't really use disguises properly since friendly fire is always off and everyone shoots teammates as they pass by.
while wearing pve gear can give an edge, it is also a gamble, and I'd respect more a team's ability to adapt on the fly rather than having a big sign that says ZOMGPVEGEARS.
while wearing pve gear can give an edge, it is also a gamble, and I'd respect more a team's ability to adapt on the fly rather than having a big sign that says ZOMGPVEGEARS.
aimlessgun Apr 22, 2008 at 1:57 pm
+1 votes
It's a gamble that shouldn't exist in arena, because it can make matches a complete crapshoot. It is detrimental to the game and to the competition.
The mod as stands would save me maybe a second of mental calculation while I reference my table of corruption values. The point of the mod is not to make things easier, the point of the mod is to discourage the abusive use of PvE gear entirely and actually make the mod useless. I'm just looking for a way to force people to stop using excessive PvE gear, and asking them nicely isn't going to cut it.
The mod as stands would save me maybe a second of mental calculation while I reference my table of corruption values. The point of the mod is not to make things easier, the point of the mod is to discourage the abusive use of PvE gear entirely and actually make the mod useless. I'm just looking for a way to force people to stop using excessive PvE gear, and asking them nicely isn't going to cut it.
bife Apr 22, 2008 at 3:17 pm
+1 votes
I think you're blowing it out of proportion.
it's not any more of a crapshoot than if they switched to another comp that counters yours. At least with the gear detail you can make a decision in seconds and adjust accordingly whereas with a comp switch you could end up in an loss before the gates even open.
It's a fair gamble IMO because they gain a weakness (low resilience) along with their strength (higher dps).
it's not any more of a crapshoot than if they switched to another comp that counters yours. At least with the gear detail you can make a decision in seconds and adjust accordingly whereas with a comp switch you could end up in an loss before the gates even open.
It's a fair gamble IMO because they gain a weakness (low resilience) along with their strength (higher dps).
Vadim Apr 21, 2008 at 7:41 pm
+1 votes
i could see this being extremely useful in tracking druid's resilience/pve gear, for example a druid/lock/rogue or warrior team
Stryider Apr 21, 2008 at 8:10 pm
+1 votes
This is actually a great idea. Sucks for most comps that I run (I play both a rogue and a druid) but would certainly even it out for most other people.
Kcolraw Apr 21, 2008 at 9:03 pm
+1 votes
sounds doable but gotta take everything into account, talents etc
Maldazzar Apr 21, 2008 at 11:26 pm
+1 votes
not quite as simple as you're making it sound
spell warding, warrior stances, natural perfection, focused will, soul link, etc -- all aren't that easy to track and will **** up your results (would work with rogues, i suppose)
spell warding, warrior stances, natural perfection, focused will, soul link, etc -- all aren't that easy to track and will **** up your results (would work with rogues, i suppose)
aimlessgun Apr 22, 2008 at 12:12 am
+1 votes
Yea, the variations in something like Corruption are very slight as is, and lower damage dots will make things even wilder. So a very polished version would take a lot of work.
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