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Forums >  GameRiot Forums >  The Pub
Poll: Iori's conundrum
Poll Question:
Should Iori drop out of college immediately and start working to repay them as a show of adherence to his own socialist values?
Yes.
He should default the loans by ending his own life.
No, hypocrisy rocks!
dub
Level 45
Joined: Jun 22, 2008
Posts: 726
Location: Cologne
Posted: Nov 17, 2009 10:48 am EST
Vir said
The stagnation of the middle class in America has everything to do with globalism, and nothing to do with a lack of socialism.

The only thing that simply doesn't work is socialism, but hey, get looted more.
GLOBALISMZ you say? Alright then, thanks for the argument. It's a matter of politics how countries deal with international trade.

Either way, back to web development.
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Level 36
Joined: Sep 26, 2008
Posts: 1221
Location: Somewhere in the midwest
Posted: Nov 17, 2009 10:55 am EST
dub said
I really love the same old arguments like "PAY ON YOUR OWN" "TAXES ARE THEFT" "CHARITY" and whatnot. I know supply-side economics sounds good on paper and it was well worth the try, but empiric data strongly suggests that the trickle-down logic has largely failed -- both the United States and, to a lesser extent, the United Kingdom are good examples for this: the middle-class evaporates while most of them head downwards, the manufacturing sector has been shipped off and mostly retail jobs return, household debt explodes, income inequality is on third world levels, public schooling is awfully bad which reaches well into the undergraduate level so especially the US has to rely on foreign talent, infrastructure is falling apart... and so forth.

As for voluntary charity instead of governmental redistribution: it simply doesn't work. The problem isn't only that people don't donate on their own, but also that public pooling of money is vastly more effective than many small charity foundations throwing money at some projects. Our economic system has a lot of elements that lead to redistribution from the bottom to the top, so it's hard to argue against a high marginal tax rate.

Sure you can argue on the basis that you should be the one to decide what happens to your money, but the benefits a society gains from subsidizing certain services is definitely higher than the few dollars off my paycheck. Just compare the quality of living in some European higher tax countries to the US.
I was arguing with someone over that the last night. Giving to charity doesn't really fix much, especially when those charities have administrative cost.  The government has far better tools at their disposal to fix a lot of issue that affect America, and throwing pocket change on the street isn't going to do much. Especially when some of these charities are 501(c)3 Tax shelters for some of these rich folks.
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Vir
Level 59
Joined: Feb 13, 2008
Posts: 2360
Location: Dethecus
Posted: Nov 17, 2009 12:14 pm EST
dub said
GLOBALISMZ you say? Alright then, thanks for the argument. It's a matter of politics how countries deal with international trade.

Either way, back to web development.
CAPATALIZAM U SAY?  CLEARLY CAPATALIZAM IS AT FAULT FOR BAD TRADE POLICIES.

PS-UR GAY
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Vir
Level 59
Joined: Feb 13, 2008
Posts: 2360
Location: Dethecus
Posted: Nov 17, 2009 12:15 pm EST
Iori said
I was arguing with someone over that the last night. Giving to charity doesn't really fix much, especially when those charities have administrative cost.  The government has far better tools at their disposal to fix a lot of issue that affect America, and throwing pocket change on the street isn't going to do much. Especially when some of these charities are 501(c)3 Tax shelters for some of these rich folks.
Governments don't have administrative costs higher than private charities <----Iori Logic.
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dub
Level 45
Joined: Jun 22, 2008
Posts: 726
Location: Cologne
Posted: Nov 17, 2009 12:26 pm EST
Vir said
CAPATALIZAM U SAY?  CLEARLY CAPATALIZAM IS AT FAULT FOR BAD TRADE POLICIES.

PS-UR GAY
I'm not the one throwing words like socialism and globalism around. I also never said anything against capitalism. Try to finish school, it helps.. and stop calling other people stupid, you're the last one in the position of doing so.
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Level 53
Joined: Sep 7, 2007
Posts: 1711
Location: Big Bad Los Angeles
Posted: Nov 17, 2009 1:23 pm EST
dub said
I'm not the one throwing words like socialism and globalism around. I also never said anything against capitalism. Try to finish school, it helps.. and stop calling other people stupid, you're the last one in the position of doing so.
ur mad LOL
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Level 48
Joined: Jul 29, 2007
Posts: 226
Location: Texas
Posted: Nov 17, 2009 1:30 pm EST
Vir said
Governments don't have administrative costs higher than private charities <----Iori Logic.
Baaahahaha private charities having higher overhead than the ******* national bloated government?  That is a gem.
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Vir
Level 59
Joined: Feb 13, 2008
Posts: 2360
Location: Dethecus
Posted: Nov 17, 2009 1:38 pm EST
dub said
I'm not the one throwing words like socialism and globalism around. I also never said anything against capitalism. Try to finish school, it helps.. and stop calling other people stupid, you're the last one in the position of doing so.
Ok, kid.  Have more America envy plz.  Not my fault you ******* lost ww2, don't troll America just bc ur country is a failure.
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Level 36
Joined: Sep 26, 2008
Posts: 1221
Location: Somewhere in the midwest
Posted: Nov 17, 2009 2:27 pm EST
Klynx said
Baaahahaha private charities having higher overhead than the ******* national bloated government?  That is a gem.
I didn't say they have higher overhead. I said they have overhead. Try reading.
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Level 3
Joined: Jan 6, 2009
Posts: 9
Location: 
Posted: Nov 17, 2009 4:18 pm EST
Iori said
I didn't say they have higher overhead. I said they have overhead. Try reading.
As a champion for socialism (a government system where the government controls much of the economy), it is natural to assume that when you make a comment such as "charities have overhead", you think there would be a better place for the money to go. You have also made multiple posts that support the idea of heavier government involvement, i.e, more money given to/spent by the government. I'm not trying to oust you, but it is pretty obvious how people used to debating with you can infer things from your post that you did not intend to put across.

Oh, and government will typically have more overhead than charities.
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